High Zinc and Speech

Discuss autism diets and biomedical treatments of autism.

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gennighia
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High Zinc and Speech

Postby gennighia » Thu Aug 06, 2009 7:55 pm

OK, we saw a huge jump in my son's speech a few months ago when we tried a mega dose of zinc (50 mg, he's 32lbs) which the dr. said would be fine for 3 weeks, no more. Well, when we went down to 30 mg he was steady, but lost some of the speech ability he had while he was getting 50 mg. he started putting together noun-verb sentences that were relevant and conversational. And asking questions. We went back down to 30 mg. and then 6 weeks later started chelation (DMPS suppositories). We've done 3 months of chelation, which have been hard on him--we've battled bacteria and some yeast most of the time. We lost a lot of speech through that--he was back to just grunts and repeating back what you said when he got really upset.
Now, I make jello and put his zinc and magnesium in it--it just works best for us, no fight, no fuss. Yesterday I made a double batch and had them all in the fridge and before I realized it, he had eaten two days worth of zinc. Today his speech has been great! I had some paint on my forehead (painting over his latest masterpiece on his brother's wall and swiped some hair out of my eyes) and he was picking on it. When I can see a thought process, I tend to try to give him the words so I said "Mama, you have paint on your forehead!" and he repeated, "Mama, you got paint head!" and laughed that I understood. Later he asked for me to put on the home movie of him where he had fallen asleep in his swing.
So, has anyone else had this experience? Should I just up his zinc and see if it sticks?
--genni

Grace
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby Grace » Thu Aug 06, 2009 9:13 pm

I am not sure about zinc improving speech but it sure sounds like he is benefitting from it!
I am wondering why your doc only approved the high amount for a short time? My girl is about 50 pounds and takes 70 mg daily for at least a year. She did take a break from all minerals during the biofilm protocol but now that we are done with that, we are right back to the 70 mg per day of zinc.
~Blessed to be called Mama by many~

bookwurm
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby bookwurm » Fri Aug 07, 2009 2:12 am

There is an ongoing study that is looking at treating autism by using zinc to reduce copper levels. I emailed the researches and the results should be out in another year. I fully expect the study to be a success. I suspect copper-induced oxidative stress is probably a leading factor in autism and more important then mercury. Many of the DAN! measures aimed at mercury would also have the effect of lowering copper levels.

Be careful though - copper is an essential mineral and if you give too much zinc you could reduce copper levels too far. Someone posted about having this happen to her child here. If you use large doses of zinc, zinc and copper blood levels should be regularly monitored.

JeniB
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby JeniB » Fri Aug 07, 2009 6:59 am

Someone also mentioned in the biofilm concept that the kids dumped tons of copper with this treatment, Copper is used to combat bacteria and yeast in swimming pools, I imagine our bodies will congregate copper to do the same thing, and then when it dies off, your blood stream gets flooded with copper, which is bad for the brain. Copper also antagonizes zinc, so where you need zinc it will be depleted, like your immune system. Not to mention, the birth control pill increases copper levels in women. The body needs copper to function though. I bet the fluctuating copper levels because of the bad bugs cause many of the autistic behaviors. I'd imagine giving copper after chelation is necessary in small amounts. I actually think a transdermal cream of copper would benefit our kids because it all goes to the bad bugs if taken orally.

Jen
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Dylynn
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby Dylynn » Fri Aug 07, 2009 1:55 pm

Very interesting! I might just up our zinc for a couple weeks and see what happens.
Son - Somewhere on the Spectrum

jen78fl
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby jen78fl » Fri Aug 07, 2009 2:18 pm

This is interesting. I just ordered Brainchild zinc which I hear is suppose to be really good... Right now I only give my son 20 mg of zinc a day but am thinking I should increase it. Our DAN said between 20 to 40 mg is good.. How much do most of you use?

Rockhopper
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby Rockhopper » Fri Aug 07, 2009 4:37 pm

http://www.pyroluriatesting.com/ This is supposed to be the best company for testing for it.
Last edited by Rockhopper on Mon May 09, 2016 7:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

engagements
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby engagements » Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:04 am

I was interested to hear also that your Dan only wants you to give high Zinc for a little while. We are giving 100mg of zinc to my son 35lbs. I have worried that this is too much, but his blood test still show Zinc at 80. DAN would like it to be 100 especially before chelation.

Another thought, my son used to have a copper tint to his hair and have brown eyes. after using NDF plus he has hazel to blue eyes, no copper color and blonder hair all the copper color is gone. I asked my DAn about that and he thought maybe it was from swimming in the sun, but I noticed this happening before we hit the pools during the summer.
~God is doing a thousand things in one thing~
http://www.donteatus.com/

gennighia
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby gennighia » Sat Aug 08, 2009 2:06 pm

I had brought this up a while ago about Wilson's Disease (a House episode) and wondered if our kids could have something like a milder case of it. I was told that Wilson's was too rare to be an issue for our kids.
With this, I really think it is more of an issue than any one likes to think. I'm not saying it's a magic bullet, but I think it is a piece of the puzzle. I too have noticed my son's hair getting an orange/red tint when we give high zinc for a few weeks. I also have noticed his brown eyes getting lighter.
His zinc level was pretty good when we had our last hair test, as was his magnesium level. However, I see a HUGE difference in behavior and speech when we lower these doses. I'm going to have to ask the doc about leaving the zinc up for a while. Got to research the down side of too much zinc!
--genni

JeniB
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby JeniB » Sat Aug 08, 2009 3:19 pm

I have posted about this hair color thing before. I had noticed on my son's bad days he has an orangish tint to his hair. I think another mom had noticed this as well. My guess is with the yeast die-off, copper is getting released and showing up in the hair. how it does this, I don't know, but I definitely notice it all the time. It also is more curly those days. Good days are straight and more blonde for sure. My husband thinks I'm crazy, but I think it is a big clue. His zinc levels were low when we tested him last. maybe this is why some kids show a mild regression when adding zinc, it is a detox reaction or copper goes a bit crazy when adding zinc at first? There is something to this hair color and eye color thing.

Jen
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respect
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby respect » Sat Aug 08, 2009 4:40 pm

there is a saying, no zinc, no think.

we are going to try homeopathic zinc. zinc supplements will only reach so far on a very physical level, but homeopathic zinc is supposed to reach levels that the other cant, on a very energy driven level. homeopathic zinc will get to the reason why your child needs zinc in the first place. zinc malabsorbtion or loss is linked to MR.

we use 60mg a day, 30 is very low. watch cause it can cause nausea.

Rockhopper
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby Rockhopper » Sat Aug 08, 2009 7:19 pm

I think it would be great if William's Dad weighed in...

navyautismdad
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby navyautismdad » Sat Aug 08, 2009 8:18 pm

I second that comment about nausea. If we exceed 40 in a given dose (empty stomach, though) my son gets nauseous.

I'm trying to get him up to 100mg a day for both pica and speech reasons.

williams_dad
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby williams_dad » Sat Aug 08, 2009 9:03 pm

Rockhopper wrote:I think it would be great if William's Dad weighed in...


Well I was watching this thread with considerable interest anyway ...

I would strongly urge any zinc supplements to be zinc picolinate because that it the most bio-available form and least likely to cause problems, if not that then zinc gluconate. Don't waste your money on Zinc sulphate !

http://spectrumsleuth.10.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=20

and just as a postscript

Thorne make Picmins
http://www.fxmed.co.nz/ThorneProductInfo/PicMins.htm

WD
http://spectrumsleuth.fr.yuku.com/forums/11/General/General

jen78fl
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby jen78fl » Sat Aug 08, 2009 10:29 pm

Anyone know if the brainchild zinc (krebs chelate) can cause upset stomach at higher doses?

JeniB
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby JeniB » Sun Aug 09, 2009 7:37 am

I've heard the zinc form zinc monomethionine is easily used by the body. Don't know about how it fares on the stomach though.

jen
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respect
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby respect » Sun Aug 09, 2009 9:44 am


OneRockAtATime
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby OneRockAtATime » Sun Aug 09, 2009 10:23 am

So here is the million dollar question! I looked up the zinc picolinate online and saw it as cheap as $5 and as expensive as $20 does price matter and or does someone know of a good place to get this. Plus what about transdermals? Ahhh so many questions!

jen78fl
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby jen78fl » Sun Aug 09, 2009 3:00 pm

I have used Solgar zinc picolinate (22 mg) for years now and really like it

OneRockAtATime
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Re: High Zinc and Speech

Postby OneRockAtATime » Sun Aug 09, 2009 4:27 pm

The Zinc taste is awful though I would love one that was a transdermal but not sure who's transdermal is the right kind of Zinc. I guess I could always call everyone tomarrow morning and see what they have to say about their transdermals and if they are the right kind.


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