Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Discuss autism diets and biomedical treatments of autism.

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crazydaddy
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 1:05 pm

Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby crazydaddy » Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:20 am

Hello,

About 1.5 months ago we put my kid on the GFCFSF diet and he did great; within 4 weeks he was more calm, focused, etc., etc.

At this point I'm seeing some of the gains taper off (not regress but am watching out for it) and we are in the process of testing for yeast, etc. which I highly suspect based on his pooping activities.

Meanwhile I'm trying to educate myself about the differences between GFCFSF (maybe adding Sugar Free as well on top of the Soy Free) and the other diets that have been shown to work for ASD kids. Specifically GAPS, SCD, also another diet called 'feast without yeast'.

Would it be possible to have some feedback on what has worked for different parents participating here? What are some pros/cons? I noticed GAPS is all foods made from raw materials which may be a challenge for my family, but is SCD a simplified GAPS?

Any other points or pointers to where I can find out more about the comparisons would be welcome.

Many thanks!

jaumeb
Posts: 167
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 10:48 am

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby jaumeb » Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:58 am

I've been trying the different diets you mention. I am currently using a diet of buckwheat, quinoa, amaranth, brown rice, some veggies, goat yogurt, some meat, some wild fish, extra virgin olive oil and extra virgin coconut oil.

crazydaddy
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 1:05 pm

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby crazydaddy » Thu Feb 16, 2017 8:49 am

One material that I found that summarizes this quite ok is here:

http://www.tacanow.org/family-resources ... s-for-asd/

I'm still looking at the feedback from parents as it looks like GFCFSF has worked the best for the majority of people based on what I'm seeing in the summary of what worked best.

Grandmother
Posts: 59
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2016 7:47 pm

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby Grandmother » Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:45 am

The problem with GFCFSF is that it often doesn't eliminate enough.  Daughter first eliminated those things, plus corn and all additives, and grandchild improved but it wasn't enough.  The SCD (adapted for autism by also eliminating casein) removes all those things plus a lot more, but grandchild was very severe to begin with.  Your child may not need more eliminations.

GAPS is based on SCD but apparently emphasizes bone broth with every meal.  As someone on this Board pointed out elsewhere, bone broth has a lot of lead and her child did not do well with it.  Fortunately, there was no way my grandchild would consume bone broth anyway, so even the SCD intro diet was skipped.  Daughter just kept eliminating food until grandchild was on the diet.

Grandchild was cured on the SCD diet, with no yogurt, fermented food, bone broth, gelatin, etc., also using the other things I told you about earlier (cod liver oil, MB12, Nystatin, enzymes, etc).  She had a die-off reaction eliminating the last grain, which was rice, so I'm sure she would not have done well on the Feast Without Yeast diet which allows rice, not to mention the arsenic in rice today, but that diet might help another child. 

You should ask your doctor about the differences and which diet he recommends.  If your doctor is who I think he is, his website has a link to the SCD diet.  Also remember that you can switch or modify any diet at any time.  Best wishes.

Nikkie111
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Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2015 6:26 am

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby Nikkie111 » Thu Feb 16, 2017 3:18 pm

GFDFSF can be really unhealthy especially with all these grains that really should be properly prepared soaked etc
Can you imagine they could be eating gluten free pizza, buckwheat porridge and pasta all day
For some kids like mine it didn't work
We did gaps and after about months we removed all dairy (was worried about glutamate) and now we are basically Gaps without milk
We pretty much started seeing more gains after gaps, things were very slow before then

crazydaddy
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 1:05 pm

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby crazydaddy » Thu Feb 16, 2017 4:30 pm

My kid's diet is not too bad:

- gluten free bread (one small slice every day);
- eggs;
- fruit;
- coconut yogurt, different flavors;
- meats (hot dogs, chicken, beef, pork, as much organic as possible);
- cereal (gluten free, need to check for the grains that may be in there);
- rice milk - we're trying to pair this down or reduce it if possible;

He's not that heavy on carbs but we need to do a better job tracking it and putting in good/better foods. GAPS may not work for us because it appears that it needs *everything* made from scratch at home.

Nikkie111
Posts: 359
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2015 6:26 am

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby Nikkie111 » Thu Feb 16, 2017 5:33 pm

Making everything from scratch is not that big of a deal :D
You can easily do some roast chicken with butternut squash noodles or beef stew with passata or some fish cakes.
Most of these stuff are either too easy to do or you can make few meatballs or fishcakes and free a few
For breakfast you can have coconut yogurt with fruit or avocado with honey pudding
Just recently we started some boiled potatoes that's the only non gaps thing we do but I soak it from the night before

So you can have a balance but just keep an eye on those grains... And the cereal you use that would be interesting to see what's in it :D
If you want to know 100% what's going in your kid's gut yes you have to make it yourself ...

Edit: wanted to add : ohhhhh those hot dogs... Do you know what's in them? And that nice pork that has parasites that don't even get killed with heat?

Grandmother
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Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2016 7:47 pm

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby Grandmother » Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:11 pm

As Nikkie said, it really isn't that hard.

Breakfast can be the leftover dinner, which it often was for grandchild. 

Make chicken nuggets in large batches and freeze.

Also, check out Applegate Hot Dogs, as well as their other products.

crazydaddy
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Dec 07, 2016 1:05 pm

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby crazydaddy » Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:29 pm

Grandmother wrote:As Nikkie said, it really isn't that hard.

Breakfast can be the leftover dinner, which it often was for grandchild. 

Make chicken nuggets in large batches and freeze.

Also, check out Applegate Hot Dogs, as well as their other products.


He is getting the applegate hot dogs right now...

Interesting view on the pork and we'll check the ingredients.

I'm thinking we move him from GFCFSF first to eliminate the sugars which are excessive for him at the moment, and make it a GFCFSFSF diet...as much as possible. Right now as a 2 year old he's supposed to have a max of 17 grams of sugar per day and I notice that one yogurt (SoDelicious Coconut blueberry yogurt alternative) has 18 grams.

He's getting water with minimal apple juice just for taste (about 1:10 juice to water).

After going GFCFSFSF we can try the SCD -minus- the dairy as the next step.

Nikkie111
Posts: 359
Joined: Thu Sep 24, 2015 6:26 am

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby Nikkie111 » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:38 am

crazydaddy wrote:
Grandmother wrote:As Nikkie said, it really isn't that hard.

Breakfast can be the leftover dinner, which it often was for grandchild. 

Make chicken nuggets in large batches and freeze.

Also, check out Applegate Hot Dogs, as well as their other products.


He is getting the applegate hot dogs right now...

Interesting view on the pork and we'll check the ingredients.

I'm thinking we move him from GFCFSF first to eliminate the sugars which are excessive for him at the moment, and make it a GFCFSFSF diet...as much as possible. Right now as a 2 year old he's supposed to have a max of 17 grams of sugar per day and I notice that one yogurt (SoDelicious Coconut blueberry yogurt alternative) has 18 grams.

He's getting water with minimal apple juice just for taste (about 1:10 juice to water).

After going GFCFSFSF we can try the SCD -minus- the dairy as the next step.

Have a look at the ingredients of that yogurt... One of them guar gum, have a look at the rest of them
You're probably better off soaking buckwheat for two days and making porridge
You can go down the route of processed GFDFSF all I'm saying is that you might not see results as quickly as you would on a cleaner, non-processed diet as what these ingredients are doing are irritating and inflaming the gut

Grandmother
Posts: 59
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2016 7:47 pm

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby Grandmother » Fri Feb 17, 2017 7:03 pm

Crazydaddy, you're on the right track finding those hot dogs.  Grandchild loves those.

That yogurt looks healthy on the outside, which is what food manufacturers do.  Fortunately, my daughter had a nutritionist at the beginning of her journey who told her to eliminate all additives, so I'll pass that on to you.  Grandchild has never had yogurt but, like Nikkie, I also looked up the ingredients and several of them are the usual code names of glutamate.  Early on, grandchild regressed after an accidental ingestion of glutamate in sliced turkey, so I know what a small amount did to her.  Try giving him just blueberries and eliminating the yogurt.  I'd be curious to know if he improves.

Daughter switched grandchild from apple juice to organic pear juice since apple juice isn't permitted on the SCD diet, but she needed something to mix the supplements in, so juice was never eliminated. 

Sugar was one of the first things daughter started eliminating for the SCD diet.  She had already eliminated high fructose corn syrup along with all additives.  Keep a close eye on your son as you start reducing sugar, looking for his behavior about an hour after sugar.  That's how daughter discovered grandchild's yeast infection.

Best wishes.

TMS
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2017 6:07 pm

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby TMS » Wed Feb 22, 2017 6:36 pm

GAPS is meant to be restorative, and not all the restrictions are necessarily permanent. My son has not responded negatively to the bone broth. We have never been fully on GAPS. I am currently reading Dr. Josh Axe's book Eat Dirt. His restorative gut protocols do not seem quite as restrictive. He has a gut type quiz to customize the recommendations.
As far as grains, seeds, and nuts, these should always be soaked, sprouted, or fermented to neutralize anti-nutrients and predigest nutrients. This concept led me to find lots of good info and whole food recipes.

imsimplyadad
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Mar 04, 2017 5:32 pm

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby imsimplyadad » Sat Mar 04, 2017 5:39 pm

We started a low carb, low sugar, low oxalate diet for our son about a year ago. He's not cured by any means, but the middle of the night 2 hour giggle fests have disappeared as has the extreme food meltdowns. I wrote all about our plan on my blog. Essentially, we follow a paleo plus type diet. Only fruit we allow are berries or ones that are fermented and no nuts. I'm not sure what the rules are about posting links here, but if you go to imsimplyadad.com/treating-autism-with-diet. You can find what we are following. I've also got a few recipes on there too. I tried doing GAPS with my son for my own GI symptoms and I didn't notice any changes in how I felt nor any improvements in his behavior. I think we're on to something with our low sugar, high fat approach. I feel better, and his behavior has been more manageable.

jaumeb
Posts: 167
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 10:48 am

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby jaumeb » Sun Mar 05, 2017 6:43 am

Thanks simplydad for writing that article. I tried low carb and low oxalate with no results. Now I think it is a matter of using the right carbs. I am experimenting with quinoa, buckwheat, brown rice, etc.

i-jerry
Posts: 170
Joined: Wed Dec 21, 2016 7:46 pm

Re: Diet summary and feedback: GFCFSF vs GAPS vs SCD vs?

Postby i-jerry » Fri Mar 10, 2017 7:01 am

we are on gfcf, sugar free, low carb, no root veg, no grain, no friut,,,,

so mainly my son has meat, egg and veg as his meal. I believe he benefit from his diet but not sure how much


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